• Grail@multiverse.soulism.netEnglish
    28·
    2 days ago

    I like political movies like Star Wars. Political books like The Hunger Games. Political music like Enter Shikari. Political games like Frostpunk.

    For Me, politics isn’t the same as fighting. That’s your worldview. You’re the one who thinks politics is being angry and hurt. For Me, politics is life and joy. And what you are doing is resulting in people forgetting that all that joy they feel comes from politics.

    To Me, that meme is political and it’s fun, and as a trans person, I would hesitate and worry about posting it on your community. Because the message you are sending, regardless of your intent, is intimidating to people like Me. You can’t control that except by admitting that politics is fun.

    I love gathering around the board game table to play Secret Hitler or Coup. I bet you like politics too, and you’ve just forgotten it. If you’re not a centrist, then admit that you’ve had an absolute blast with politics some of the time.

    • Dupelet@piefed.socialEnglish
      82·
      2 days ago

      There are a lot of definitions of the word ‘political’. I made it pretty clear in the rules that I was referring to Trump, the megacorps, and general gloom and doom of the day stuff. By that definition, none of your examples are ‘political’. Yes, you have your own definition that differs, but since we’re discussing the community and what it stands for, that’s the one that matters at the moment.

      Star wars? Hunger games? Frostpunk? Sure, post content about them, I’ll be the first to upvote them.

      It sounds like you’ve ascribed a definition and intent to the community that’s very different from what I stated in the sidebar, in which case this is actually just a semantics discussion of what ‘politics’ is.

      • Grail@multiverse.soulism.netEnglish
        24·
        2 days ago

        If you choose to use a different definition of a common word than everyone else, you’re gonna have to reckon with semantics. If you made a community called c/aryanmemes and explained you’re using “aryan” to mean “nice person”, people would call you a Nazi for using a Nazi dogwhistle. “Politics” as a negatively loaded word is also a conservative dogwhistle. I’m upset with you for using a dogwhistle and expecting people not to be offended.

        • Dupelet@piefed.socialEnglish
          42·
          2 days ago

          If you choose to use a different definition of a common word than everyone else,

          This is the first definition from Cambridge dictionary. I don’t see how my definition differs significantly.

          the activities of the government, members of law-making organizations, or people who try to influence the way a country is governed:

          “Politics” as a negatively loaded word is also a conservative dogwhistle

          Perhaps in the US. I would remind you that you’re on a global website. Most of us use politics to mean, well, politics, not whatever conservative bullshit is going on.

          • Grail@multiverse.soulism.netEnglish
            23·
            2 days ago
            Wikipedia says:  
the set of activities that are associated with making decisions in groups, or other forms of power relations among individuals  

Merriam-Webster (My personal favourite) says:  
competition between competing interest groups or individuals for power and leadership (as in a government)  
and:  
the total complex of relations between people living in society  

Collins says:  
the actions or activities concerned with achieving and using power in a country or society.  
and:  
the ways that power is shared in an organization and the ways it is affected by personal relationships between people who work together

            So, anything having to do with power or decision making within a group of people is politics. When you and your mates decide which takeout place to order from, the decision follows a political process. When your parents told you it was bed time, they used political power. When you come to trust someone’s opinion in guiding your personal decisions (like whether you should really include the chapter on bird mating calls in your work in progress fantasy novel), you’re engaging in politics.

            Politics is all around us. It’s ridiculous to have a negative opinion of it. If there were no politics, there would be no societies, no families, no friendships, and no romantic relationships, because there would exist not a single mechanism for any group to have unified purpose or choice.

            Unless you misdefine politics. That’s the trick. And it’s a very easy trick, you can do it without noticing. All you have to do is think in the back of your mind “politics is anything I disagree with”.

            Boom. So long as you have the rhetorical skill or the social power to defend this assertion, you can take advantage of the propaganda of the ruling class for your own ends, and attack any goddamned idea in the world you want. You have an intrinsic claim to legitimacy in proportion with your ability to normalise your own opinions, and anyone who disagrees with you is committing “violence”. You have a terrible and destructive power to silence any and all dissent. What you say will go. Nobody can stop you.

            What I have described just now is the worst extent of the power of belief in apolitics. Most people who believe in apolitics won’t act this way… if you don’t push them. If you keep agreeing with what they say in a vague sense, or phrase your disagreements charismatically, they won’t use this power. But it’s still there. And there is no sense at all in leaving around terrible powers that reinforce hierarchies of norms. Especially not if you are queer, neurodivergent, disabled, of colour, otherkin, or anything else that goes against the status quo. Because in a battle to attack the political, that which can claim legitimacy through normalcy will always win.

          • Grail@multiverse.soulism.netEnglish
            22·
            2 days ago

            I’m people who try to influence the way a country is governed. I’m a political activist. In fact, if you vote, you’re people who try to influence the way a country is governed too. So everything you and I do is politics, and the term has very little meaning.

            But that definition is kind of bad, I much prefer the various other definitions I analysed on My blog. I could make the same arguments over again, but I don’t want to.

            TL;DR: Everything is political.

            • Dupelet@piefed.socialEnglish
              21·
              2 days ago

              Also at this point, it’s very clear that we’ve devolved into an argument about semantics, as I asserted a few comments ago. While I disagree strongly with your definition, I see no chance either of us will be changing each other’s mind and I have no interest in trying.

              All I ask is you stop misrepresenting the community when it’s very clear that we’re talking about different things. I hope at some point you’ll see the value of having safe spaces for people, whether or not you need it yourself.

              • Grail@multiverse.soulism.netEnglish
                21·
                2 days ago

                I do value safe spaces. For example, MULTIVERSE is a safe space for minorities such as otherkin, and I am currently having an internal debate over whether the users here should have to see your apoliticism. Your political ideology is something we consider dangerous and do not want to see. So I am weighing the cost-benefit of allowing the users on this website including Myself to rebutt your political viewpoint against the cognitive burden of feeling a responsibility to do so.

                Obviously there would not be any issue if you simply avoided expressing your apoliticist politics.

                • Dupelet@piefed.socialEnglish
                  11·
                  2 days ago

                  Oh gods, the irony.

                  I’m stepping away from the conversation now. Thanks for keeping the conversation civil, even if we disagree.

                  • Grail@multiverse.soulism.netEnglish
                    21·
                    2 days ago

                    Yes, that irony was on purpose. I know you won’t reply, but I’ll explain. You want a space free from politics, where your political viewpoint is enforced. That’s hypocrisy. We want a political space for our ideology, where our political viewpoint is enforced. That’s logical and consistent. What I’m saying is, what you want is impossible, because you broke your own rules. You’re already on our side of this debate, you’re just struggling against yourself and hurting your own aims. And I hope one day you get on the same page as yourself.

            • Dupelet@piefed.socialEnglish
              32·
              2 days ago

              Your article is based on a false dichotomy to begin with, that politics is either ‘all human interaction’, or ‘stuff I disagree with’. You miss the common definition that most of the world operates by, where politics relates to stuff related to governance.

              When your parents told you it was bed time, they used political power.

              By your definition perhaps. Most of us disagree.

              Everything is political.

              No, you’ve changed and diluted the word to the point it’s meaningless and taken away a term that’s actually useful. You want to redefine it for yourself, sure. But stop acting as if everybody else agrees with (or is even aware of the existence of) your definition.

              • Grail@multiverse.soulism.netEnglish
                21·
                2 days ago

                The nature of our society is that we are always actively participating in governance of the social groups in which we participate. The common definition is My definition. Even at this very moment, we are arguing over how to govern your community, and you are through well-intentioned carelessness poorly governing My identity, by accidentally misgendering Me. Our every action is political. I ask that you be aware of this fact, rather than retreating from responsibility.