Not hating on open source, just let people use what fits their expectations and needs and stop deterring them with gatekeeping :P
UX = user experience
This one dude has made this app for years and constantly updates it, fixes things, is responsive, and makes a great app. He’s now been more loyal to his users longer than Reddit has, and I personally have used his app daily for 13 years.
Yeah, I’ll happily pay for it.
FOSS is great but it doesn’t pay the rent people, this guy is doing this mostly as his main gig. This isn’t some huge corpo, it’s one guy who makes his living building the app he loves. I’m sure he’d love to make it FOSS if he didn’t have to pay bills on anything.
FOSS can pay the rent. But the users that will complain about £20 for a lifetime of ad removal, definitely aren’t going to be the ones that help him should the bank come calling about late mortgage payments.
This is the same crap I left /r/Linux for way back in the day, so so so many people who are all “Linux is the best way and you’re stupid for even considering windows or mac” but unable to see realities. Yes, of course I love linux and FOSS, I use it as my primary driver, but we live in a society where free work doesn’t pay for housing.
You’re exactly right, most of the “FOSS Open Source supreme” people will look at an app that was lovingly crafted for months, call it garbage, and then demand they make it free. I just can’t even with them.
Meanwhile I’d love to see the stats on how many hours a week they put into FOSS apps on their own, and if they’ve given up their jobs to code for FOSS apps for the good of the community.
I’m a developer. I code mostly proprietary stuff for my company. I’d gladly go code for FOSS projects, but so far my bank is just completely unwilling to cancel my mortgage payments, and my electricity, water, sewer, internet, they all want to be paid too, so unfortunately I’m stuck doing this.
“Free and Open Source Software Open Source supreme”?
I think the issue a lot of folks have is people like yourself always connecting it back to profit/salary. A large portion of us are interested in Linux/technology/foss for personal reasons and this corporate stuff not only reeks but makes enough noise to drown out better long term solutions. Yes I do it professionally too and yes I fight the good fight but we do what we need to do, this dude does not need to do this. UX really just isn’t important when we’re talking about expanding human capabilities, or I should say UX is important but pretty things aren’t. My opinion anyway but I was raised to care about this stuff by one of those wizard beards so to see your attitude is prevalent just sucks, no disrespect and nothing personal.
That’s fine as your opinion, but it’s not a popular one. Many people tried lemmy and left almost immediately because they want a better UI. We come from the old usenet boards so we know what UI was like back then, but now people expect a great UI/UX to use a service. So yes, I understand the principals, but we shouldn’t demonize people who pay money for a better experience, and if you’re a developer I’m sure you know that a good UX costs some money, but a great UX costs a lot of money.
There’s also a lot of younger techies on the board cause if you even got remotely deep enough you’d have to learn how to use those user board websites to solve your extremely specific problems.
Lemmy doesn’t have ads. If you have to pay to remove them don’t you think something is wrong with that? Why not pay for the community and useful features instead?
The ads finance the app, I think that’s perfectly fine (in principle).
I asked the dev a few weeks ago, this app is literally his livelihood. And he has a pretty good track record of delivering good software. Why not support him?
If you think more ads is the solution that’s good for you. Ads are society’s cancer, so I have little choice other than to block it. (Paying to get rid of ads perpetuates the idea that ads are profitable. That’s up to you.)
So the three options for him to keep developing that we know of are 1) Ads 2) Pay for a license or 3) Fundraising. He offers 1 and 2, and 3 is well known to not work, seriously nobody donates. Check out
npm fundand how so little people used it that they just removed it.If your only argument is “I deserve things that took a lot of time and effort for free” then you aren’t getting much sympathy from me.
If your only argument is “I deserve things that took a lot of time and effort for free” then you aren’t getting much sympathy from me.
Well, the user is posting from the piracy instance
ha
Check out npm fund
Instructions unclear, I ran the command and now I have a shitcoin called Bitcoin Cash.
So for one he’s adding an option to fund your instance as well, but also just because it’s an app doesn’t mean that it also doesn’t require money.
Your argument doesn’t come off as “so both should be free” but to me more like “oh yeah I’m surprised Lemmy doesn’t have an ad option”
I’ve been on open source since the early 90s. I know damn well how people make money off of it and who makes money off of it.
I support none of it if it starts including tracking and ads. It goes against the whole mindset. Google fanboys love it though.
Then pay to remove the ads. Someone has to pay at some point and it’s either you or the guy already spending his time to make the app.
That’s why there is an option to disable ads… Everyone wins unless they think this person’s work should be distributed for free.
You’re not paying to remove ads from Lemmy. You can continue using Lemmy ad-free on mobile via the mobile site or any of the other PWA’s or native apps. What you’re paying to remove ads from is Sync. The developer has decided that they need to be compensated to sustain the amount of effort developing and maintaining the app requires. If you don’t want to pay that price with cash or your eyeballs then don’t use it.
Nobody is forcing you to use Sync, nobody is forcing you to see ads. The beauty of a platform like Lemmy is you have the choice to use whatever client you want. That doesn’t mean you’re entitled to any of them.
Upvoted via Sync lol. FOSS is great, FOSS is irreplaceable, but for independent programmers FOSS doesn’t pay the rent.
I understand people’s concerns and criticism over the use of Google-based ads, but I have no issue paying for no ads knowing how much work has been put into the app. I’m glad we have some great FOSS options as well (shoutout to Infinity and Thunder, among others!)
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The price is a bit steep for me personally, but I agree. I’m currently on Connect but the call from Sync is strong.
You can make it FOSS and still have some sort of subscription for syncing between devices for example. Tasks.org did it like that.
Not to mention that you can run something on donations like lichess or F-Droid and have some extra money.
NPM did donations too and found that <0.01% of users paid anything, and the average for even the most used packages made on average $40 a month. That doesn’t pay a full time fry cook, let alone developer
FOSS doesn’t mean your product/service/app is free to use
This meme just explained the post meme to me
Scatterbrained me sometimes forgets to add more context, because I forget other people can’t see what’s been going on in my head prior. Now you know how people at work feel when interacting with me.
Or when I do a “by the way…” remark to something that was discussed hours before and nobody knows what I’m referring to.
My brain could be used to feed entropy to /dev/urandom
why are you talking about my brain in your comment but referring to it as YOUR brain?
I live inside your walls oO
The three stages of a long-term FOSS user:
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How the fuck do I do anything? I’m so lost.
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I’ve somewhat mastered how to use it and became a power user. I’m happy about this, I’ve developed a sense of superiority over those who don’t use it, and will now promote it constantly to others like a goddamn cult. My SO has left me and my family has disowned me, but I don’t care, they are too ignorant to be as enlightened as I am.
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(A decade or two later) I don’t even give a fuck anymore what somebody uses, this still works for me, and what works for you, works for you. Let’s just all coexist. OS and app development models don’t mean shit, common standards and protocols between them do. As long as I, a Linux user, can email a PNG to a Mac user and they can open it, we’re good.
It’s been like this since the mid-90s. Most of the people who are being annoying about it are in stage 2.
Thank you. Exactly what is happening and why I’m so exhausted. Feels like the stupid Mac vs Windows debates back in the day, with the even more annoying Linux users.
I have the (perhaps irrational) fear that sitting too comfortably in stage 3 leads to the kind of complacency that allows things like Web Environment Integrity to escape the “shower thought” phase.
On principle I believe that people shouldn’t feel forced to restrict themselves to FOSS - I use Steam and barely ever pirate games
(ignore my Lemmy instance I guess); however, I think people should put some effort in understanding the consequences of always choosing the path of least resistance, at the very least.I’m currently a mix between 1 and 3. Learning 2, but not the shitty part of it.
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Unfortunately I don’t know how in your case as I’m not even on Lemmy, I’m on Kbin.
This is a prime example of my last point though. Interoperability is all that matters, and we can still communicate even using completely different servers and apps. Just like email. I don’t remember there being giant internet flamewars over email clients back in the day, people thought of email as “just email” and it didn’t matter what you used.
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Don’t forget this is a community built around Open Source software with many refugees who came because proprietary apps were forced on them.
The Lemmy protocol is open source and you’re free to use an open source solution. You’re free to use sync for Lemmy in much the same way you can run a Spotify client in Linux. One does not destroy the other.
Tldr if you don’t like it, don’t use it.
but shouldn’t I go online and complain about it loudly?
How will anyone know I exist if they can’t hear (or read) my bitching?!?
Yeah, but only if you agree with the other people who are complaining loudly, otherwise it’s hardly worth the time.
Yeah yeah, but OP made a post about it so I thought I’d add some of the reasoning behind people being that way. I don’t care what app people use as long as I can use the one I like.
There are FOSS alternatives available. I personally use Jerboa daily.
Yeah I’m aware of the alternatives but I thought it could do with some rationale as to why people aren’t overly impressed with Sync as they were on Reddit. Nothing against the app tbh, happy with the one I have.
This is not a proprietary app (in the first party terms, it’s still a 3rd party app)
- Yes Okay I get it, yes it’s proprietary, but I’m saying everyone was gleefully using proprietary 3rd party apps on Reddit, Apollo was proprietary, RIF was proprietary, proprietary was not forced on anyone. 1st party apps were forced on us all.
- This is literally one of the apps Reddit killed off
- It’s literally not being forced on anyone
It is by definition a proprietary app.
But it is proprietary. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Proprietary_software
I think the comment you’re replying to is not talking about late Reddit refugees but early FOSS enthusiast that were on Lemmy before. You’re missing the point.
literally no one is forgetting about that - And the great thing about Lemmy is that no one will ever be forced to use an app they don’t want to use, whether it be closed source or open source.
What OP is (rightly) complaining about, is the huge amount of holier-than-thou rhetoric that’s plastered all over the front page of Lemmy right now giving users shit for wanting to use a closed source app.
I love FOSS, I’m typing this comment on a linux desktop right this moment (arch, btw) - but sometimes the best tool for a job (by my own completely subjective opinion) is a closed source tool. Using a closed source app to access an open source system isn’t a betrayal of that open source system.
If you personally don’t want to use a closed source solution, or if you specifically think that Sync is a bad solution for any number of possible reasons, then you’re free to continue using open source solutions, I really don’t see why so many people care so much about what apps other people are using, Sync existing doesn’t take anything away from open source solutions (except maybe users, but again - you can’t force people to use your software)
I have a problem with writing text that doesn’t read negative or angry, so a little disclaimer beforehand: it’s not :D
I see your point, I don’t tell them to change or not to embrace open source.
I like open source for various reasons (especially for learning), but not everything I use has to be open source by default.
I also understand the reasoning behind apps like Sync to remain private (non-paying user btw). If you put so much effort into a project you can go two routes: release it public or keep it closed and try to monetize it. When I use an open source app extensively and it brings value to my workflow or makes my daily tasks easier I’ll throw a few bucks their way (or a server license once), but how many really do that? If you release your app publicly with the option to pay or to see ads to, some people could just fork it and re-release it, stripped of both monetization models that were intended as support for the developer. (Again, from the point of view of a developer that wants to see some return for their investment of time.)
In my point of view we have the benefit of an open platform (unlike reddit). If any dev of a proprietary client fs up, you can change it without repercussions. Unless all instances suddenly decide to restrict API access or make their API pay-to-use all at once, we won’t see a shhow like with Reddit.
Sometimes I want something that works as expected and gives me a pleasant/polished experience when using it.
Forgive my exaggeration, but I usually don’t use my free time to look through the code of every program I want to use, at some point we reach that “I’ve read the TOS” problem", feels like no one even reads that anymore.
Everyone is always promoting that app, so I don’t understand why y’all are butthurt when anyone complains about it.
It’s almost like the internet is a collective of different voices and not one unified entity…
I don’t think apps have to be FOSS. It’s super important for libraries, frameworks and other infrastrucuture related stuff to be FOSS, but you can always change a client.
The great part of the fediverse is that everyone can use whatever they want. Personally I stick to Foss clients though.
I installed sync yesterday, and it’s nice. It’s very usable without paying for it. In fact, the only reason I could see paying at all is to support the creator. The ads are negligible. I had to look for them to notice em. Basically if you don’t wanna use it, don’t. Not very complicated imo. There’s other apps and the web browser. Your paying for the interface not the content.
This may be just my own individual experience, but the ads were worse before he released the first patch. Now I barely see any ads unless like you said I’m looking specifically for them. Although I’m used to RIF which had the same amount of frequency in ad space so I might be slightly biased.
FOSS or die
#NoFOSSNoFuss
Infinity for the rescue
This whole Sync “issue” (is not an issue for me) has brought to light the way many people in the Lemmy communities feel about FOSS, free apps, ads even privacy, developers’ compensation, etc. It’s been interesting, still paid those $20 tho.
Can I lift that blank template off you bruv that’s a funny meme
Used this convenient site
I do find it a bit odd to monetize a client for a service which is 100% free. Not necessarily against it, but it bothers me slightly.
@THED4NIEL Use whatever tools you want for yourself, EXCEPT for communication. For communication it needs at least two people and the other party now has to use software that doesn’t respect their freedom just to communicate with you.
