YouTube disallowing adblockers, Reddit charging for API usage, Twitter blocking non-registered users. These events happen almost at the same time. Is this one of the effects of the tech bubble burst?

  • designated_fridge@lemmy.world
    link
    fedilink
    arrow-up
    106
    ·
    1 year ago

    Most of the aspects have already been covered but I would want to add one:

    This was always the plan, it just wasn’t as highly prioritised as growth.

    I work as a developer at a big tech company. We (the company) had our roadmap and it was mostly about getting more users. The more users you have the day the economy turns - the better off you are (… If you manage to turn an profit).

    So when the economy went to shit and we (and other tech companies) no longer can loan money for free to cover our running expenses - the priorities shift. Working towards attracting more users is only going to increase your costs at the point and you don’t want to run out of money. So all roadmaps changed and cost saving efforts became the highest prio all of the sudden.

    • Raildrake@vlemmy.net
      link
      fedilink
      arrow-up
      23
      arrow-down
      1
      ·
      1 year ago

      Gain a monopoly, get users addicted and reliant, then change the rules of the game and hope they stick with you. It’s happening now because of the economy for sure, but it’s not like it’s surprising.

  • Rinox@feddit.it
    link
    fedilink
    arrow-up
    68
    ·
    1 year ago

    I think it’s a consequence of higher interest rates drying up VC money, meaning that tech companies now have to actually be profitable, rather than just grow.

    If the plan was grow now, profit later, then later has come

    • InverseParallax@lemmy.world
      link
      fedilink
      arrow-up
      20
      arrow-down
      1
      ·
      1 year ago

      Nailed it, investors are demanding profit increases, it’s not just interest rates (though they’re the main reason) but also the corporate tax cuts in 2018 basically dumped a ton of profit onto corporations because they repatriated all their offshore cash they’d been hoarding.

      That bump lasted 2 years, but the expectation of higher revenue is still there, it doesn’t matter if you got lucky at slots last month, if you make your normal salary this month investors will be absolutely pissed.

      • insomniac@sh.itjust.works
        link
        fedilink
        English
        arrow-up
        18
        ·
        1 year ago

        This sounds too stupid to be real but I was working for one of the largest corporations in the world during this period and we were congratulated on 20% growth even though we did nothing. Of course we didn’t get an extra bonus or anything but they acted like we had an incredible year when we really just had an average year with a massive tax cut.

        Then the next year, our goal was to grow at 20% again and when we missed it by 17%, no one got a bonus or raise.

        This timeline is the stupid one.

        • EddieTee77@lemmy.world
          link
          fedilink
          English
          arrow-up
          6
          ·
          1 year ago

          This is what irritates me. You still made money just not as much as you wanted or hoped so your company punishes you. You can’t have infinite growth

        • Bautznersenf@feddit.de
          link
          fedilink
          English
          arrow-up
          1
          ·
          1 year ago

          Most companies really are that retarded because everyone wants to look good and take credit for every great thing happening. People like that should not be in charge of anything.

    • AgentOrange@lemmy.world
      link
      fedilink
      arrow-up
      9
      ·
      1 year ago

      This is also a great example of why higher interest rates aren’t automatically a terrible thing. In general, it’s probably a good sign for the economy that companies are expected to be profitable. Means resources are being used well. The limitless VC money kinda meant any dumb idea regardless of merit got funding.

      • MsPenguinette@lemmy.world
        link
        fedilink
        arrow-up
        11
        ·
        1 year ago

        I wish we lived in a society where not everything needed to be profitable. People deserve treats and sucks to have things that made our lives better go awake because shareholders demand money

        • cynar@lemmy.world
          link
          fedilink
          arrow-up
          6
          ·
          1 year ago

          There are a number of ways things can function that way. Unfortunately, they don’t scale well.

          This is part of my hope of federalisation, it lets a group of small entities act as a single large entity. It also lets non-profit and profit making work together. The for-profit provide the brute force, the non-profits keep them from going off the rails too far. It might be the workaround we need.

          Also, be the change you want. For-profit businesses often win due to the far better returns. More people are willing to pour the effort into a business that could make them rich than a charity that never will.

        • assassin_aragorn@lemmy.world
          link
          fedilink
          arrow-up
          4
          ·
          1 year ago

          I think we’d see loads of improvements if the philosophy went from “be as profitable as possible” to “just be profitable”. You’re 15% lower than last year, but still profiting? That’s just a smaller bonus for all employees and a smaller dividend for the investors, after putting a healthy amount of it into savings.

          There’s no concept of “enough”. That’s the big problem. It goes for both economics and career advancement. There doesn’t always have to be a “higher”. It’s okay to say “it isn’t worth it to go further”.

        • Whether we like the ongoing enshittification of Reddit or not, I think it’s fair that shareholders expect a return on their investment and they have the right to pressure spez to seek aggressive monetization of the platform.

          That problem wouldn’t have existed if Reddit was a non-profit though, like the Wikimedia Foundation.

          • hellequin67@lemmy.fmhy.ml
            link
            fedilink
            arrow-up
            5
            ·
            1 year ago

            expect a return on their investment and they have the right to pressure spez to seek aggressive monetization of the platform.

            Whilst I agree that investors have everybright to expect a return on investment I think this could have been resolved and a number of ways which didn’t include alienating a large proportion of the user base.

            • darthsid@lemmy.world
              link
              fedilink
              arrow-up
              4
              ·
              1 year ago

              Exactly I’m tired of all these capitalism apologists. The aim is to innovate, there must be a more decent way to monetise or profit. If pursuing such hardline tactics means profitable at the expense of your customers and enshitification of your platform, I’d urge you to reconsider your business setup.

              • poVoq@slrpnk.net
                link
                fedilink
                arrow-up
                2
                ·
                edit-2
                1 year ago

                The capitalism apologist is going to tell you that this is necessary for innovation as Venture Capital firms fund 100 start-ups of which 99 fail to turn a profit, and thus the 1 that does has to make up for the other 99 by making extreme profits.

                But that that is just as flawed logic as thinking that there can be a “decent” capitalism that doesn’t destroy everything in its path in its pursuit of profit. If you are trying to be “decent” you will be out-competed by someone else under the current economic setup.

                • Steve@compuverse.uk
                  link
                  fedilink
                  arrow-up
                  4
                  ·
                  edit-2
                  1 year ago

                  The modern Neoliberal capitalist philosophy of shareholders being the only priority, isn’t the only capitalist philosophy.

                  The Embedded liberalism after the new deal, worked quite well. Since the employees are making the products, and management is making the decisions, while the shareholders don’t directly make anything for the company; People understood that the shareholders were the last priority, in getting profits. It’s why worker wages scaled with productivity until the 80s.

                  That’s when the Neoliberal capitalist philosophy took hold and gained power. First the Republicans with Regan, then Democrats with Clinton, then the global economy, since so much of it is driven by the US.

              • bodmcjones@sh.itjust.works
                link
                fedilink
                arrow-up
                1
                ·
                1 year ago

                I think in part there’s an essential misunderstanding of current events at the core of Reddit’s behaviour (not yours, I mean - spez/investors/etc).

                Historically the rule was supposed to be ‘if it’s free, you’re the product’, which is to say that our attention (and profiles and demographics) were on sale to advertisers. The big recent development is someone figuring out, or thinking they’ve figured out, how to monetise us a different way - specifically, by using the things we create as training data for AI. A sensible organisation would continue to balance these two possible cash flows and, since both really require user retention to remain profitable in the long run, seek a middle ground. But the perception is that there’s more money in the training data than there is in the user attention, so they focus on maximising that and spit on the users. The obvious consequence is that they lose users and their source of training data dries up.

              • EdgeOfToday@lemm.ee
                link
                fedilink
                arrow-up
                1
                ·
                1 year ago

                I don’t think the problem is earning a profit, the problem is the need to earn even more profit than last year. Investors aren’t content to buy into a company like Reddit just to let it continue in a steady state. They want to double their money in a few years and then cash out. They don’t care if they destroy a valuable service that many people enjoy.

            • I don’t think investors are the ones who told spez how to run things. They likely simply pressured him to make changes as quick as possible to make Reddit profitable. Investors don’t usually specify how to generate that profit though, otherwise they’d run their own companies.

              • Bautznersenf@feddit.de
                link
                fedilink
                arrow-up
                1
                ·
                1 year ago

                Twitter has been around for so long, it takes some time to kill. The latest move to allow access only to verified users together with meta may actually kill it though.

        • tool@r.rosettast0ned.com
          link
          fedilink
          arrow-up
          1
          ·
          1 year ago

          I don’t think the problem is so much profitability as it is the demand/expectation for endless growth. It becomes a positive feedback loop and is completely unsustainable after a certain point.

          You know what else is endless growth? Cancer.

      • any dumb idea regardless of merit got funding

        That’s still the case and high interest rates haven’t really fixed that because they are still not high enough. Just look at how any company mentioning “AI” in their earnings call gets extra billions in market cap overnight without having a real product yet.

      • damnYouSun@sh.itjust.works
        link
        fedilink
        arrow-up
        0
        ·
        1 year ago

        That rather assumes that it actually matters that VC money is being wasted.

        After all it keeps the money in circulation and keeps people employed. They then get paid and will then buy useful things from companies that do make profit, so in the end it all works out. It’s only bad for the investors, but that’s always been the thing about investment, it’s always been a risk, and it’s never been guaranteed.

        • Confused_Idol@lemmy.fmhy.ml
          link
          fedilink
          English
          arrow-up
          2
          ·
          1 year ago

          If the goal is simply to keep money circulating and people employed, there are more efficient ways to do that.

          Reddit, as a whole only has about 2000 employees.

          • bionicjoey@lemmy.ca
            link
            fedilink
            English
            arrow-up
            2
            ·
            1 year ago

            “only 2000 employees” Reddit should have maybe 200 employees. 2000 is an insane number of people for a single relatively simple piece of software.

            • can@sh.itjust.works
              link
              fedilink
              English
              arrow-up
              2
              ·
              1 year ago

              Especially since they have free content moderation. What are all those people even doing? They couldn’t even keep Victoria for AMA’s.

      • pulaskiwasright@lemmy.ml
        link
        fedilink
        arrow-up
        0
        arrow-down
        1
        ·
        1 year ago

        This seems like a non sequitur: what is good about only profitable ventures getting funding? These unprofitable ventures were creating good jobs and providing enjoyable and sometimes useful products to consumers for low prices. So why is it good that funding is drying up?

        • andyster@lemmy.world
          link
          fedilink
          arrow-up
          2
          ·
          1 year ago

          It doesn’t seem completely crazy to me that it would be better for money to go to successful projects than just be sprayed like a fire hose in hope that you land a Facebook or Google sized moonshot.

          Of course it sucks for the people that lose their job, but presumably that money should go towards sustainably growing things where they could work.

    • zos_kia@lemmy.fmhy.ml
      link
      fedilink
      arrow-up
      6
      ·
      1 year ago

      No. I don’t mean to be rude but most of that message is wrong.

      VC Money is very much not drying up. 2023 has seen record rounds in most markets. What is drying up is “VC Money for early stage startups with no revenue, no traction, and barely a functional idea”, but even that is not new it has been going on since at least 2018. Remember that guy who raised 1.5M$ with an app that just let you say “Yo” to your contacts ? That was 10 years ago. Those times are dead and buried.

      Then the link between VC markets health and interest rates is… contentious to say the least. VCs don’t borrow money - they raise funds from family offices and individual investors, every 2 or 3 years. So every change to the financial landscape will have a progressive effect over 3 years, not a brutal one after a few months. Also you have to bear in mind that the people who bankroll VCs are looking for performance of at least 2X over 10 years. Interests would have to go up to 7% to even be in competition with VC investment. Of course there’s a psychological aspect to investment so the effet is not ZERO but it’s not as automatic as saying “interest go up => vc dry up”.

      Finally, the companies we are talking about are in vastly different situations and not necessarily looking for VC money. There is no explaining their behaviour with a single cause, what we’re seeing is probably a cluster effect, because executives are like fish they always follow the movement of the other fish in their field.

      • Youtube has been profitable for years and is part of Google which is massively profitable. VC Money has no bearing on their decisions - they are in a quasi-monopoly with no credible competition and want to squeeze their users out of greed
      • Reddit has a long and complicated cap table including some very powerful institutional investors so they are aiming at an IPO rather than more VC money. They’re in a pretty good place actually with 1.5 billion MAU, and in the process of shaking off the 10% of hardcore users who are super hostile to monetization. Their monetization is so low (<2$/month/user, when the competition is 10 to 20 times higher) that they could bear to lose 50% of their userbase and still make bank with the remaining ones. They don’t need VC money right now.
      • Twitter is… uh… well there’s no telling what Elon is up to but he is absolutely not raising any VC money especially after the shit he’s pulled off since the buy-off. I think it’s just a bunch of bad moves because he’s inept at the social media game.
      • dhork@lemmy.world
        link
        fedilink
        arrow-up
        4
        ·
        1 year ago

        Their monetization is so low (<2$/month/user, when the competition is 10 to 20 times higher) that they could bear to lose 50% of their userbase and still make bank with the remaining ones.

        What’s left unsaid here (but I’m sure you realize) is that these same users whose monetization is so low also provide most of the content and moderation on the site. When you spread out the value of that among the (human) userbase, the total value returned to Reddit by each human is higher.

        Steve thought he was targeting the AI with this move, but in reality he has been charging his most engaged users. If he’s upset that Apollo has turned a profit, the correct move was to acknowledge that one guy has done a better job than Reddit’s team, not tell all the users that Apollo helped bring to Reddit that they were no longer welcome

        • zos_kia@lemmy.fmhy.ml
          link
          fedilink
          arrow-up
          2
          ·
          1 year ago

          I think they’re operating under the assumption that there is no shortage of people willing to work for clout on a leading social media. They think the users they lose are replaceable and you know what it’s not an unreasonable expectation. It sucks but that’s just the way it is, there will always be people willing to post memes and delete nazi comments.

          Only time will tell, but it’s not uncommon to kick out power users when they get uppity and think they run your platform. Way easier/cheaper to fire unpaid volunteers than tech-bros with Silicon Valley salaries.

      • cryball@sopuli.xyz
        link
        fedilink
        arrow-up
        2
        ·
        1 year ago

        Couldn’t it be argued that it’s a mistake from reddit to think of themselves as being comparable to platforms that make more money per user?

        For example reddit and youtube are completely different in terms of the nature of the platform. Could attempting to monetize an average reddit user to the level of those using youtube might be a mistake? Keep in mind that reddit has much lower overhead for keeping the service running.

        The mental image I’m going after is a country that exports mainly wheat arguing that its’ exports should be valued the same as a country that produces complex electronics. The products are at a different realm of complexity. Commodities should be valued for what they are and not be confused with higly refined products.

        • zos_kia@lemmy.fmhy.ml
          link
          fedilink
          arrow-up
          2
          ·
          edit-2
          1 year ago

          Couldn’t it be argued that it’s a mistake from reddit to think of themselves as being comparable to platforms that make more money per user?

          You’re right it could very much be argued. I mean isn’t that the whole underlying question ? I would imagine that anybody who invests in reddit has the assumption that yes, you can monetize comparably to other platforms. Or even cut the pear in half and sit comfortably at 10$/user which would already be a fucking money printer at >400M MAU.

          Now whether they are right or wrong in their thesis is anybody’s guess. Even after the recent debacle reddit is still in a very good position, but social media is such a clown world that you can never really tell.

      • suspecm@lemmy.world
        link
        fedilink
        arrow-up
        1
        ·
        1 year ago

        I’m not so sure about Google nowadays. What started out as an everyday product killing, ended up as the first of many. They killed Stadia from one day to the other, and then started to basically sell and kill everything that is not massively profitable to the point they sold their domain distribution as well to Squarespace. That does not seem like something a massive monopoly with no regards to investor opinion does.

        • zos_kia@lemmy.fmhy.ml
          link
          fedilink
          arrow-up
          0
          ·
          1 year ago

          Well i don’t know about that. They still generate 15B$ in profit every quarter. Sure they’re losing some growth, but even amid a historic advertising budget bust they are still beating expectations.

          When i mentioned their monopolistic position i was talking more specifically about Youtube, but anyway buying and killing off products is standard operating procedure for a company this size on a market this mature. There’s nothing alarming about Google’s health.

          • BelEnd@lemmy.world
            link
            fedilink
            arrow-up
            1
            ·
            1 year ago

            99% of their profit comes from their search engine ad revenue though. Google has only ever had one truly profitable product and the advent of chatgpt, driven by their only true rival in Microsoft, has them scared shitless. They are way behind in the AI department and it’s the only thing out their that fundamentally threatens Googles goose with the golden eggs: their search engine.

        • zos_kia@lemmy.fmhy.ml
          link
          fedilink
          arrow-up
          3
          ·
          1 year ago

          Google in panic mode cause they don’t know if they’ll be able to close their 10M$ round from local VCs 😱

    • leanleft@lemmy.ml
      link
      fedilink
      English
      arrow-up
      1
      ·
      edit-2
      11 months ago

      maybe inflation.
      just because U don’t see a price tag doesnt mean its not there.
      if you cant see the product, then you are the product!
      the state of wellbeing had never really been that great to start.

  • RIotingPacifist@lemmy.world
    link
    fedilink
    English
    arrow-up
    55
    arrow-down
    3
    ·
    1 year ago

    Part of it is the standard crisis of capitalism, the profit you get from doing the same thing always declines, so over time you have to push up revenue (increasing prices, forcing people to pay, showing more ads, gathering more data, etc) & push down costs (fire engineers, run on less hardware, etc)

    Part of it is capitalisms natural tendency to create monopolies, and the lack of competition in a given field causing the company to then lose sight of what it’s good at to compete in a bigger field.

    Part is that interest rates mean loans are no longer cheap, so taking on debt to get customer, to at some point down the line make money, is a less viable plan. Twitter is a special case where the bad loans are because that was the original deal not interested rate related, and Musk is trying to pull all of the enshitification levers at the same time.

    Part is that CEOs generally don’t have a fucking clue about their products or what they are doing (it’s a circuit job about who you know/blow, not what you know), so once one CEO starts firing/enshitifying, the rest just copy them so as to not be left out.

      • Sploosh the Water@vlemmy.net
        link
        fedilink
        English
        arrow-up
        35
        ·
        1 year ago

        Capitalism is a system built on greed as a foundation to function. In a capitalist system, you must always continue to grow, expand, engulf, absorb, and acquire. This is why it is such a toxic and destructive system. Capitalism will always incentivize companies to get the most people possible to spend as much as possible on as little as possible, that’s literally the core principle of maximizing profitability.

        It’s why enshittification keeps happening, the system isn’t broken, it’s working exactly how it’s supposed to.

        • jwagner7813@lemmy.world
          link
          fedilink
          English
          arrow-up
          2
          ·
          1 year ago

          Wouldn’t capitalism be relatively fine without the function of the Stock Exchange? I feel like the stock Exchange is what causes the issue with the need for continual growth. I feel like capitalism without the overarching need to continuously grow due to the demands of the stock exchange system, could work perfectly fine as you wouldn’t need to continuously grow but to maintain a profit and adjust for inflation where needed.

          • Sploosh the Water@vlemmy.net
            link
            fedilink
            English
            arrow-up
            5
            arrow-down
            1
            ·
            1 year ago

            Capitalism codifies the acquisition and control of capital by an owning class separate from the workers (employees). The owners always want to see their profits grow, because in a system that is zero sum, where competition is glorified as the primary mechanism for fair pricing and business success, if you aren’t growing, then other competitors will eventually extinguish you.

            Capitalism mimics evolution in that way, where all organisms compete against each other in a winner-takes-all setting. Talk to any hardcore Capitalist and they will talk about Capitalism being the “natural order”, “human nature” etc. I know, I used to be a hardcore free market capitalist.

            A system that places profit and private ownership of capital above all else will always result in the kinds of oppressive systems and company practices we see today.

            It’s like how fundamentalist religious institutions are having abuse scandals over and over for literal centuries. They are built in such a way that makes abuse easy to get away with. Even if it starts out perfectly clean, safe, and incorrupt, eventually the very structure of the organization itself will cause abusers to join or allow already abusive people to commit those acts without significant consequences. It is a negative feedback loop that perpetuates itself until it collapses totally or is extinguished by an outside force.

      • RIotingPacifist@lemmy.world
        link
        fedilink
        English
        arrow-up
        13
        arrow-down
        1
        ·
        1 year ago

        It’s not pure greed though, if companies do not push down costs & push up revenues enough, they get replaced by those that do.

        It is capitalism doing what it does “best”, here’s a clip from I’m A Virgo that explains it better than me: https://youtu.be/lpagmvYZKRc?t=84

        There are niches where companies can hide out for a while, especially if they provide a service that needs local implementation, but social media isn’t one of those niches, if you get outcompeted, your toast, no matter how big you peak, MySpace, Tumbler, Digg, Slashdot, etc, this is the monopolization effect of markets.

  • kromem@lemmy.world
    link
    fedilink
    arrow-up
    45
    arrow-down
    1
    ·
    1 year ago

    No tech burst.

    It’s just a cold recession. No one is admitting it, including consumers who keep spending away savings.

    But companies are aware of it enough they are tightening purses preparing for harder times ahead.

    Of course, it’s a self-fulfilling prophecy.

    If everyone makes their products worse chasing this quarter’s dollar, and people leave, those companies are going to have a harder time.

    Especially as it becomes easier and easier to compete against them at scale.

    Just wait until new feature requests and bug reports for something like Lemmy can be handled within moments by AI at dirt cheap pricing.

    A very interesting future awaits around the bend.

  • Quill0A
    link
    fedilink
    arrow-up
    37
    ·
    1 year ago

    I find it the ad bubble is bursting so companies are increasing costs for api access and divert people into using their own apps (so they can’t block ads and such)

  • Sanctus@lemmy.world
    link
    fedilink
    arrow-up
    32
    arrow-down
    1
    ·
    1 year ago

    We have reached the stage where the snakes have grown large enough that they must prey on their own tails, for there is nothing left to eat.

      • pentobarbital@vlemmy.net
        link
        fedilink
        arrow-up
        5
        arrow-down
        1
        ·
        1 year ago

        Correct me if I’m wrong but this is baked into capitalism. Stocks are attractive to investors because they want to sell them for a higher price later on, and stock prices increase when the company grows.

        • lazynooblet@lazysoci.al
          link
          fedilink
          arrow-up
          2
          ·
          1 year ago

          You’re right, thats a requirement for investing into a stocks value. A company can make a healthy flat profit every quarter and its direct benificiaries (investors, stock-holders, directors, owners) will be appropriately accomodated financially via dividends. It doesn’t need to be 30% growth year in year out. You start to add stock price, inflation, etc. and it gets complicated. I don’t understand it from then on.

          • pentobarbital@vlemmy.net
            link
            fedilink
            arrow-up
            1
            ·
            1 year ago

            My understanding is a little shaky too. I suppose companies are incentivized to target infinite growth so they can get the most money out of the stocks they hold, but this is a culture and greed thing, not a hard requirement.

        • statue_smudge@lemmy.world
          link
          fedilink
          arrow-up
          1
          ·
          1 year ago

          Not every stock has to be a growth stock, their value can be based on expectations of future dividends.

          However, tech stocks are priced assuming growth, so the owners would lose a lot of money if it becomes clear that growth is no longer possible.

          • pentobarbital@vlemmy.net
            link
            fedilink
            arrow-up
            1
            ·
            1 year ago

            I know about dividends but decided to keep the comment simple. Aren’t dividends relevant only in utility and holding companies?

            • statue_smudge@lemmy.world
              link
              fedilink
              arrow-up
              1
              ·
              1 year ago

              Kind of, because those sectors are widely known to not be growth-oriented. There is only so much demand for electricity for example.

              At one point that was probably a growth sector, but now it is ubiquitous. Perhaps someday some tech stocks could be focused on dividends rather than infinite growth.

  • Grant_M@lemmy.ca
    link
    fedilink
    arrow-up
    37
    arrow-down
    14
    ·
    1 year ago

    When billionaire fascists start being held to account, they lash out.

        • Temple Square@lemmy.world
          link
          fedilink
          English
          arrow-up
          3
          arrow-down
          1
          ·
          1 year ago

          Elon Musk does fascist things.

          But that doesn’t mean every bad thing Elon Musk does is fascist. Sometimes it’s just greedy. Or stupid.

          • Hypersapien@lemmy.world
            link
            fedilink
            English
            arrow-up
            1
            ·
            1 year ago

            So, even if a person does fascist things, the fact that some of the bad things that they do aren’t fascist means that the person isn’t a fascist?

            A person isn’t a fascist unless every bad thing they do is fascist?

            Is that what you’re saying?

      • McrRed@lemmy.world
        link
        fedilink
        English
        arrow-up
        6
        arrow-down
        2
        ·
        1 year ago

        It’s unclear whether it’s a misuse of the word in this case… though amassing billions is a fascistic event. You can’t do it without stepping all over people. Many people.

  • hoshikarakitaridia@lemmy.fmhy.ml
    link
    fedilink
    arrow-up
    23
    arrow-down
    1
    ·
    1 year ago

    There are a lot of reasons for this general trend, but let me add my two cents to make a case for the sudden influx of user-opposed changes:

    I don’t have a source for this, but I remember that Linus spoke about this on the LTT WAN-Show. Basically, abunch of big silicon valley investors are pulling out of all of the big platforms, therefore leaving them with a huge hole in their profitability. This means, that right now a lot of them are scrambling to scrape together more money over time, so all of those platforms are sustainable.

    Obviously this has to observed in conjunction with all of those are trends that are already mentioned by other comments, but this gives more basis as to why now, and why to this extent.

    If someone else knows what I’m talking about please add quotes and sources because I don’t like the good old ‘dude trust me’ guarantee one bit.

    • kubijoe@programming.dev
      link
      fedilink
      arrow-up
      10
      arrow-down
      1
      ·
      edit-2
      1 year ago
      1. Reddit API charges: Reddit announced it would begin charging for use of its API, specifically for companies that crawl Reddit for data without providing any value back to the users. This change does not apply to developers building apps and bots that enhance the Reddit experience, or to researchers using the API for academic or noncommercial purposes. Reddit’s move is tied to its attempt to monetize the vast array of user-generated content on its platform, which includes data used to train text-generating machine learning models like OpenAI’s ChatGPT. This announcement comes as Reddit is preparing for a potential IPO later this year. It is estimated that Reddit made $350 million from ads in 2021, a figure that pales in comparison to Meta’s and Twitter’s ad revenues 1

      2. Twitter’s “Ad-pocalypse”: Twitter saw a significant drop in advertising revenue in December 2022, with ad spending from top brands falling by 71% compared to the same month in the previous year. Major corporations have been pressuring Twitter over its decision to restore banned conservative accounts. There was a similar decrease of 55% in November 2022 compared to November 2021. Twitter relied on ads for 89% of its $5.08 billion revenue in 2021, so this decrease in ad revenue is likely a significant factor in Twitter’s estimated value reduction. Corporate advertising boycotts have often been used in the past to pressure social media platforms into adopting stricter censorship policies 2

      3. VC moving to greener pastures: There has been a significant increase in VC and PE investment into climate tech, which includes technologies focused on reducing greenhouse gas emissions. In the first half of 2021 alone, climate tech attracted over $60 billion in investment, which is a 210% increase from the $28.4 billion invested in the 12 months prior. This shift has been driven by a renewed focus on ESG in private markets, emerging regulations and standards, and more companies committing to net-zero strategies. The United States leads in climate tech investing, attracting nearly 65% of VC investment, $56.6 billion from H2 2020 to H1 2021 3

      Note: Sources not all quite unbiased. Take a grain of salt.

    • TheGreenGhost@lemmy.world
      link
      fedilink
      arrow-up
      8
      arrow-down
      1
      ·
      1 year ago

      This concept is also why I’m so hopeful for federated software. The federated model means that there’s no single instance that holds all the power. Many of these instances are run by admins of their own kindness and initiative. And at worst, if any instance were to start being “enshittified,” people could easily move to another instance and continue participating in the greater network.

      Between all of what we’ve seen unfold in the last few months, and even weeks, on Twitter and Reddit, it’s safe to say that “enshittification” could be reaching critical mass. That’s why I came here, after all, and I’m looking forward to seeing this community simply persist here on the web.

      • bionicjoey@lemmy.ca
        link
        fedilink
        arrow-up
        1
        ·
        edit-2
        1 year ago

        My fear is that even if you’re correct, as the internet monoliths that have been built on the past decade fall to federated software, we will lose forever an immeasurable amount of arts and culture that has been stockpiled in these corporate spaces. Think of all the great educational YouTubers whose videos won’t be able to be passed on to whatever the next thing is if YouTube collapses.

        • nuachtan@lemmy.world
          link
          fedilink
          arrow-up
          0
          ·
          1 year ago

          I think I can understand your point. Large ‘“media” companies will horde the content and refuse to let it see the light of day because they believe they own it. I don’t think that’s how it would go down. Anything I’ve ever produced to be put on the web still exists somewhere on a hard drive that I control. I doubt the big name educational YouTubers are deleting the source material as soon as it goes up to YouTube.

          Besides, a lot of the good ones have already moved to Nebula as well. If thought like educational YouTube you should check it out.

            • Absolutely. I was a big part of the non professional music production side of YouTube a decade ago. Imagine getting 100+ new songs every week, from talented artists putting everything they had into their work. It was incredible! This year I got into data hoarding and looked into downloading my old favorite songs… Turns out most of them deleted their old work from YouTube when they went pro or simply closed out their channel for personal reasons. Not even the compilation channels were still around. Hundreds of thousands of songs are just gone, along with the records of that community’s culture.

          • bionicjoey@lemmy.ca
            link
            fedilink
            arrow-up
            0
            ·
            1 year ago

            Not all of them. What about the ones who are no longer active on the platform? The ones people forgot about? The ones who have died? You think there will be 100% coverage? In the case of YouTube, many channel operators don’t actually keep a local copy of all their videos, since the files would be too big. So the only copy is the one on YouTube.

            • Spzi@lemm.ee
              link
              fedilink
              English
              arrow-up
              0
              ·
              1 year ago

              What about the ones who are no longer active on the platform? The ones people forgot about? The ones who have died? You think there will be 100% coverage?

              Maybe that’s not that much of a bad thing. The day had the same length before YouTube was a thing, and people spent 100% of their time. Differently. Some things might have been pushed out of sight by YouTube, and a dying giant can create room for new things to grow.

              • bionicjoey@lemmy.ca
                link
                fedilink
                English
                arrow-up
                0
                ·
                1 year ago

                The Library of Alexandria burning down wasn’t a good thing. Any time human knowledge that has been collected gets scattered it’s bad

                • Spzi@lemm.ee
                  link
                  fedilink
                  English
                  arrow-up
                  1
                  ·
                  1 year ago

                  I get your point, but the comparison barely holds. The Library of Alexandria had many unique works of cultural and scientific importance. YouTube is full of mundane content, mostly entertainment. Especially the scientific parts are merely re-tellings of other works which do not live on the same platform. Nobody stores their scientific findings on YouTube alone. Many creators do not upload to YouTube alone.

                  The more people value a specific video, the higher the chance it got copied elsewhere. So for the important parts, we probably have decent coverage.

          • Dr Cog@mander.xyz
            link
            fedilink
            arrow-up
            0
            ·
            1 year ago

            Unfortunately, this isn’t likely to happen. Video files are huge (tens or hundreds of gigabytes) and many creators delete old videos once they are uploaded to Youtube so that they don’t run out of space or keep having to buy more and more drive space. Even tech YouTubers like MKBHD pull clips from their old videos directly off YouTube because they no longer have the originals (he did a podcast talking about this)

            • C_M@feddit.nl
              link
              fedilink
              arrow-up
              1
              ·
              1 year ago

              That is stupid. I get that smaller creators it maybe lesss feasible to backup. Because they don’t make enough money. But a video file, certainly if you put same compression as yt, isn’t that big. Say one gb per vid, that is 30 gb a month (say times 3 for redundency) you have less than 1tb a month, of lees than 60 bucks of storage drives a month. Small price pay for someone that has a million dollar studio to not be trusting on yt for your videos. But thay also disn’t talk about the risk of putting your 2fa in the cloud, so i am not that surprised

    • NewEnglandRedshirt@lemmy.world
      link
      fedilink
      arrow-up
      3
      ·
      1 year ago

      Jesus. It’s articles like this that make me both be thankful for Doctorow and his ability to put tech shit in terms is non-techies can understand.

      • at_an_angle@lemmy.one
        link
        fedilink
        arrow-up
        1
        ·
        1 year ago

        I find it fitting that an article on enshitification is so hard to read because of enshitification on the site.

    • Chalky_Pockets@lemmy.world
      link
      fedilink
      arrow-up
      20
      ·
      1 year ago

      You joke, but Reddit did something to piss me off a few months before the current fuckery, and I decided to find an alt and there weren’t really any, like I found Mastodon but that’s more of a Twitter replacement, never encountered this site while searching. What I ended up doing was downloading a bunch of books and putting them on my phone, then putting the books app where my Apollo app used to be on my homescreen. Now, more often than not, when I go to scroll, I end up just opening a book. I’ve got a little over 40 on there, they keep my progress, even across devices, and they work when there’s no signal so I no longer have to fear public toilets with shitty cell signal lol.

      • HamalaKarris@lemmy.world
        link
        fedilink
        arrow-up
        7
        ·
        1 year ago

        I would also love to know the app! I actually did the exact same thing except I used my To-Do list app where Reddit is Fun used to be and it has honestly helped already.

        • mapiki@discuss.online
          link
          fedilink
          arrow-up
          5
          ·
          1 year ago

          I used Libby. (Just go grab a local library card and see if you can dig up any old library cards from anywhere else you’ve lived… You can have multiple libraries linked.) Also great for audiobooks.

      • Ithi@lemmy.ca
        link
        fedilink
        arrow-up
        1
        ·
        1 year ago

        That’s a good idea. There’s so much stuff I should/could be reading in the time I’m browsing social media.

        Especiallybas a software dev with all the new tech that is coming out, will hopefully get myself to do the same (with Lemmy as a backup of course)

        • Chalky_Pockets@lemmy.world
          link
          fedilink
          arrow-up
          1
          ·
          1 year ago

          Yeah, I did download a few SW engineering books, but I haven’t gotten to them. I’ve been reading Chris Hadfields books, the Apollo Murders and and Astronauts guide to life on Earth, a few cooking books like The Food Lab, The Wok, Salt Fat Acid and Heat, Mi Cochina, and some books on playing pool like The Pleasures of Small Motions.

          • Thymos@lemm.ee
            link
            fedilink
            English
            arrow-up
            1
            ·
            1 year ago

            The Pleasures of Small Motions

            That’s such an awesome title. I just wish it wasn’t about pool but more like a meditative guide on how to enjoy life through slowing down and relishing everyday things or something.

            • Chalky_Pockets@lemmy.world
              link
              fedilink
              English
              arrow-up
              2
              ·
              1 year ago

              Having read the book, if you read it for that purpose, it would work, it just uses playing pool as a medium for that.

  • bitterhalt@lemmy.world
    link
    fedilink
    arrow-up
    17
    ·
    edit-2
    1 year ago

    Because usually the greed, money and power corrupts, no matter how good you are in the beginning.

  • Ranessin@feddit.de
    link
    fedilink
    arrow-up
    18
    arrow-down
    1
    ·
    1 year ago

    Money is tighter since the inflation affects VC and stupid money flowing in. Stock prices are not going up, people have no money to play with (see the death of NFTs at the same time, the definition of a stupid investment).