Not Muslim, but by my understanding, you do your best under the circumstances, and God gets it. Also, if you’re in the middle of an emergency (say, a battle, or rush hour, or a burning building) He’ll take a raincheck.
Islam is still wretched in comparison to modern systems of morality, and is still used to prop up autocrats and tyrants, but the pillars are accommodating to circumstances.
Never really got this one in a general sense. Why pray towards a location? Shouldn’t they be praying to God. Pretty sure he’s not tucked away in that evil looking black cube building.
Many (most?) churches of the Jesus variant of Sky Daddy believers point generally eastward - it’s where the word orientation (I.e. The Orient / east) comes from. Gives people somewhere tangible to focus - and is also where the sun rises. Gets full use out of those beautiful windows to point towards sunrise and/or sunset.
Organization purposes. The entire purpose of religion is to organize people under a common belief. If everyone prays to random directions, its all chaos. Religion is all about maintaining order. It might not make sense now we all live in very sophisticated, organized societies, but we came from anarchy, and religion is derived from the fear of said anarchy. All civilizations have had some form of religion in common.
Islam came from a very tribal, disorganized place where everyone pretty much did as they pleased, especially the stronger. And so Islam has rules for everything to avoid specifically that.
You clearly have an unhealthy obsession with Islam, judging from your past comment history. I thought I was talking to just someone with an interest in sociology and origins of religion, my mistake.
And yes, all religions were pretty much popular revolutionary movements designed to uproot hierarchy in their beginnings. That changed as they became the hierarchy. I don’t know how you imagine the 7th century to be like, but it was a world full of warfare and women had more or less no rights.
Id like to think I dislike all religions equally to be honest with the possible exception of Buddhism if you call that a religion.
I’ve lived and travelled in the Islamic world widely and I take a dim view on its effect on people. I also take a dim view of rape, murder and terrorism but call me crazy - not necessarily Islamic but you guys seem to be making it your brand lately.
You’re straight from r/atheism I guess. And yes, Buddhism is a religion.
Ah yes, of course you’ve travelled ‘widely’, and likely have a Muslim friend who shares your opinions. I take a dim view on the effect of r/atheism to your psyche as well, but you’re also an interesting case, just like religion and zealots. I imagine you looked down on every person you met in the Muslim world for believing in a sky fairy, then used every negative experience to justify your biases. I certainly can’t imagine an objective judgement, and who are you to judge, really?
Oh no! You take a dim view on rape and murder? What a controversial opinion! Bravo! Guess who else? All major religions. And who exactly are ‘you guys’? I am agnostic. Why make pointless strawmen?
Most religious folk I know seem to presume the divine authorities are reasonable, at least to them. (There’s a propensity to assume that other groups, whether different religions, different races or foreigners from other countries are intrinsically evil, like goblins or Klingons or something.) It seems that most worries over sin and Hellfire and such come from ministries and apologists looking to gin up more contrition, which in the case of Christianity leads to more church attendance and tithing.
Typically, it’s when religion is invoked in social conflicts (often domestic ones) that nucleate religious identity crises. We hear about it a lot in LGBT+ cases, but it happens often enough with cis-het teens looking to establish identity separate from their parents. Hence a lot of apology is directed towards teens coming of age.
I don’t know how it works with Imams and mosques, but during the Mahsa Amini protests, Imams were the targets of outrage, with araqchin tipping (that is sneaking up and knocking his cap off his head) being a common act of defiance. It was big news when it was revealed the Iranian SLA and assembly kept their families abroad in western states, and didn’t force them to adhere to the same strict customs they commanded of Iranians.
Not Muslim, but by my understanding, you do your best under the circumstances, and God gets it. Also, if you’re in the middle of an emergency (say, a battle, or rush hour, or a burning building) He’ll take a raincheck.
Islam is still wretched in comparison to modern systems of morality, and is still used to prop up autocrats and tyrants, but the pillars are accommodating to circumstances.
Never really got this one in a general sense. Why pray towards a location? Shouldn’t they be praying to God. Pretty sure he’s not tucked away in that evil looking black cube building.
I guess I’m looking for logic in the wrong place.
Many (most?) churches of the Jesus variant of Sky Daddy believers point generally eastward - it’s where the word orientation (I.e. The Orient / east) comes from. Gives people somewhere tangible to focus - and is also where the sun rises. Gets full use out of those beautiful windows to point towards sunrise and/or sunset.
Organization purposes. The entire purpose of religion is to organize people under a common belief. If everyone prays to random directions, its all chaos. Religion is all about maintaining order. It might not make sense now we all live in very sophisticated, organized societies, but we came from anarchy, and religion is derived from the fear of said anarchy. All civilizations have had some form of religion in common.
Islam came from a very tribal, disorganized place where everyone pretty much did as they pleased, especially the stronger. And so Islam has rules for everything to avoid specifically that.
Huh, Islam TIL has rules to avoid the stronger people doing as they please.
Not sure how many women would agree with that statement. Also there were laws in the area before Islam.
If you imagine Muhammad brought peace and quiet to the region I have bad news.
You clearly have an unhealthy obsession with Islam, judging from your past comment history. I thought I was talking to just someone with an interest in sociology and origins of religion, my mistake.
And yes, all religions were pretty much popular revolutionary movements designed to uproot hierarchy in their beginnings. That changed as they became the hierarchy. I don’t know how you imagine the 7th century to be like, but it was a world full of warfare and women had more or less no rights.
Id like to think I dislike all religions equally to be honest with the possible exception of Buddhism if you call that a religion.
I’ve lived and travelled in the Islamic world widely and I take a dim view on its effect on people. I also take a dim view of rape, murder and terrorism but call me crazy - not necessarily Islamic but you guys seem to be making it your brand lately.
You’re straight from r/atheism I guess. And yes, Buddhism is a religion.
Ah yes, of course you’ve travelled ‘widely’, and likely have a Muslim friend who shares your opinions. I take a dim view on the effect of r/atheism to your psyche as well, but you’re also an interesting case, just like religion and zealots. I imagine you looked down on every person you met in the Muslim world for believing in a sky fairy, then used every negative experience to justify your biases. I certainly can’t imagine an objective judgement, and who are you to judge, really?
Oh no! You take a dim view on rape and murder? What a controversial opinion! Bravo! Guess who else? All major religions. And who exactly are ‘you guys’? I am agnostic. Why make pointless strawmen?
It must feel quite psychologically uncomfortable for people who are this superstitious.
Most religious folk I know seem to presume the divine authorities are reasonable, at least to them. (There’s a propensity to assume that other groups, whether different religions, different races or foreigners from other countries are intrinsically evil, like goblins or Klingons or something.) It seems that most worries over sin and Hellfire and such come from ministries and apologists looking to gin up more contrition, which in the case of Christianity leads to more church attendance and tithing.
Typically, it’s when religion is invoked in social conflicts (often domestic ones) that nucleate religious identity crises. We hear about it a lot in LGBT+ cases, but it happens often enough with cis-het teens looking to establish identity separate from their parents. Hence a lot of apology is directed towards teens coming of age.
I don’t know how it works with Imams and mosques, but during the Mahsa Amini protests, Imams were the targets of outrage, with araqchin tipping (that is sneaking up and knocking his cap off his head) being a common act of defiance. It was big news when it was revealed the Iranian SLA and assembly kept their families abroad in western states, and didn’t force them to adhere to the same strict customs they commanded of Iranians.