I can’t say for certain because I wasn’t given one but I can’t imagine me and my friends would have been willing to communicate with each other on devices provided by our school. Even in the early 00s it would have been filled with spyware.
I cannot possibly imagine trusting a school issued device.
Yeah for sure. My friends and I were completely paranoid about stuff like that.
Lots of wannabe authoritarians out there in educationland.
All those decades that the schools just -couldn’t afford- more (well-educated) teachers and smaller class sizes. Lots of low-end look-good.
And then along came tech, and lo-and-behold, IT was going to be the savior. Let’s buy into that! We may not be able to teach them to read, write or think, but they can learn to kneel!
I couldn’t agree more.
It’s fucking pathetic.
Citizen! Good news! Your writings have been randomly selected by Friend Computer for review!
A select team of Troubleshooters has been dispatched to bathe your general area in soothing Raytheon ™ Brain Beams until your attitude improves.
With the help of artificial intelligence, technology can dip into online conversations and immediately notify both school officials and law enforcement.
Not sure what’s worse here: how the police overreacted or that the software immediately contacts law enforcement, without letting teachers (n.b.: they are the experts here, not the police) go through the positives first.
But oh, that would mean having to pay somebody, at least some extra hours, in addition to the no doubt expensive software. JFC.
Not sure what’s worse here: how the police overreacted or that the software immediately contacts law enforcement, without letting teachers (n.b.: they are the professionals here, not the police) go through the positives first.
The idea behind the policy is to stop school shootings. If there were a legitimate threat of violence, you would likely want the police to be notified as soon as possible. The issue here is that the authorities are letting a piece of half-ass code (Read: AI) decide what is a legitimate threat and, worse still, acting on that determination without question.
They have literally sacrificed an essential freedom for some temporary, and probably illusory, security.
Man, if only there was a good way to stop school shooting
Alas, one can only dream
“no way to stop this” says the only country where this happens
Dream? Not in an American school you don’t. You need to stay alert and be ready to “RUN, HIDE, FIGHT” at any moment.
I didn’t realize the schools were using Run, Hide, Fight. That is the same policy for hospital staff in the event of an active shooter. Maddening.
I’m sorry, in hospitals? Where a significant portion of the patients can do none of those things?
They’re not residents, you’re thinking of nursing homes. Roughly a third of hospital patients can walk without assistance, but yes. The rationale is staff doesn’t turn themselves into bullet sponges, because then who is left to remove the bullets once the shooter is dead? Either way, what do unarmed, untrained (to fight) people with the body armor equivalent of pajamas do to stop bullets?
The patient room doors don’t lock. Sometimes those doors are made of glass. But herding the patients who can walk into the halls is likely an opportunity for an active shooter to hit more targets. As such, everyone hunkers down, and the police take care of it. In theory, per the training modules. Police sometimes run drills with the hospital, depending on locale and interagency dealings.
Shutting all the fire doors is likely the only defense. Those nurses can be crafty on the fly, but there are limitations.
I can’t imagine a secondary piece of this policy isn’t hospitals avoiding liability regarding workplace injury/death lawsuits.
I just hadn’t known until now that in grasping for solutions schools found the standardized hospital policy and are running with it.
I guess that the hospital is one of the better places to get shot.
Hospital staff.
I missed that part lol, mb
Having worked in quite a few fields in the last 15 years or so, it’s the same active shooter training they give everyone. Even in stores that sell guns.
I’ll let the reader decide how fucked up it is that there’s basically a countrywide accepted “standard response”
Thank you for widening this perspective. I had no idea, but it fits.
Why maddening? The active shooter response shouldn’t be all that different.
the policy is to stop school shootings
You should try Europe once. It’s more fun than your 3rd world country.
Knowing that Europe literally has a problem with its soccer audiences making monkey noises at black athletes makes this particular bit of condescension all the more ridiculous.
Idiots and assholes exist everywhere. At least ours don’t have guns.
Yeah, they use knives instead.
The knife homicide rate is literally higher in the US.
If you think I’m trying to say the US is better… by any measure LOL! -No. The US is a shithole.
My point is that if you take guns out of the equation they’ll just be replaced by something else.
This isn’t the flex you think it is.
Wasn’t intended to be. But evil people will find a way to do evil.
A lot of Europe seems to somehow have worse racism in some areas than the US. Ask a couple English people what they think of travellers and Muslims.
Is this better, worse, or the same as throwing dildos at female WNBA athletes?
Reddit moment: comparing a few racist idiots with daily murders.
“Daily murder” is a sneaky rhetorical maneuver, considering it’s something influenced more by raw population size, than by capita. It’s easy for there to be a “daily murder” in a country of 340,000,000 people, even when the overwhelmingly vast majority of people do not murder.
Using “few” to trivialize/minimize the racism is no better.
Shame on you for this disingenuity.
Even when we go per capita the US stays a shithole, it’s not like they were trying to actively misinform people.
That’s because US population has too much freedom. Gotta keep a boot on peoples neck to maintain control. Look at the 466+ people arrested for protesting
I think if the matches are having to be stopped, it’s probably more than a few.
The Asiaphobia that still goes on in the UK is absurd…
I’ll still never get over the British Dub of Takeshi’s Castle referring to contestants as “Happy Clappy Jappy Chappies” and “Kamikaze Cousins”
A shame, I really wanted to watch that version, it has Craig Charles doing the narrating, but… sorry Lister, seems you can’t help but be a smeghead around the Japanese.
Agreed on the condescension, that was uncalled for. Your whataboutism sucks though.
Oh, I’m with you on that. I’m just pointing out the thought behind the policy, however flawed. I’ve been to Europe many years ago. I would love to be there now, except that as an American I would be rightly ostracized.
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What do you mean, “try Europe?”
The police are not effective at dealing with school shootings.
Authorities be like “aww shoot, not again.”
The issue here is that the authorities are letting a piece of half-ass code (Read: AI) decide what is a legitimate threat and, worse still, acting on that determination without question.
Yeah, at the very least, the software should be passing on the statement, and context surrounding it, along with its ‘judgment’, to the authorities, putting all the responsibility for making the call that X genuinely merits action on said authorities.
Of course, that’s just one piece of the puzzle, and not a solution if law enforcement isn’t held accountable when they fuck up.
I hate how fully leapfrogged the conversation about surveillance was. It’s so disgusting that it’s just assumed that all of your communications should be read by your teachers, parents, and school administration just because you’re a minor. Kids deserve privacy too.
The cruelty is the point.
It is not the tool, but is the lazy stupid person that created the implementation. The same stupidity is true of people that run word filtering in conventional code. AI is just an extra set of eyes. It is not absolute. Giving it any kind of unchecked authority is insane. The administrators that implemented this should be what everyone is upset at.
The insane rhetoric around AI is a political and commercial campaign effort by Altmann and proprietary AI looking to become a monopoly. It is a Kremlin scope misinformation campaign that has been extremely successful at roping in the dopes. Don’t be a dope.
This situation with AI tools is exactly 100% the same as every past scapegoated tool. I can create undetectable deepfakes in gimp or Photoshop. If I do so with the intent to harm or out of grossly irresponsible stupidity, that is my fault and not the tool. Accessibility of the tool is irrelevant. Those that are dumb enough to blame the tool are the convenient idiot pawns of the worst of humans alive right now. Blame the idiots using the tools that have no morals or ethics in leadership positions while not listening to these same types of people’s spurious dichotomy to create monopoly. They prey on conservative ignorance rooted in tribalism and dogma which naturally rejects all unfamiliar new things in life. This is evolutionary behavior and a required mechanism for survival in the natural world. Some will always scatter around the spectrum of possibilities but the center majority is stupid and easily influenced in ways that enable tyrannical hegemony.
AI is not some panacea. It is a new useful tool. Absent minded stupidity is leading to the same kind of dystopian indifference that lead to the ““free internet”” which has destroyed democracy and is the direct cause of most political and social issues in the present world when it normalized digital slavery through ownership over a part of your person for sale, exploitation, and manipulation without your knowledge or consent.
I only say this because I care about you digital neighbor. I know it is useless to argue against dogma but this is the fulcrum of a dark dystopian future that populist dogma is welcoming with open arms of ignorance just like those that said the digital world was a meaningless novelty 30 years ago.
In such a world, hoping for a different outcome would be just a dream. You know, people always look for the easy way out, and in the end, yes, we will live under digital surveillance, like animals in a zoo. The question is how to endure this and not break down, especially in the event of collapse and poverty. It’s better to hope for the worst and be prepared than to look for a way out and try to rebel and then get trapped.
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Well, it may happen that these clowns will use poverty to make people want stability and voluntarily put on a collar, and if that doesn’t work, they will use force. I mean a future concentration camp. Well, and digital currencies and all this dystopian crap.
You seem to be handwaving all concerns about the actual tech, but I think the fact that “training” is literally just plagiarism, and the absolutely bonkers energy costs for doing so, do squarely position LLMs as doing more harm than good in most cases.
The innocent tech here is the concept of the neural net itself, but unless they’re being trained on a constrained corpus of data and then used to analyze that or analogous data in a responsible and limited fashion then I think it’s somewhere on a spectrum between “irresponsible” and “actually evil”.
If the world is ruled by psychopaths who seek absolute power for the sake of even more power, then the very existence of such technologies will lead to very sad consequences and, perhaps, most likely, even to slavery. Have you heard of technofeudalism?
Okay sure but in many cases the tech in question is actually useful for lots of other stuff besides repression. I don’t think that’s the case with LLMs. They have a tiny bit of actually usefulness that’s completely overshadowed by the insane skyscrapers of hype and lies that have been built up around their “capabilities”.
With “AI” I don’t see any reason to go through such gymnastics separating bad actors from neutral tech. The value in the tech is non-existent for anyone who isn’t either a researcher dealing with impractically large and unwieldy datasets, or of course a grifter looking to profit off of bigger idiots than themselves. It has never and will never be a useful tool for the average person, so why defend it?
There’s nothing to defend. Tell me, would you defend someone who is a threat to you and deprives you of the ability to create, making art unnecessary? No, you would go and kill him while this bastard hasn’t grown up. Well, what’s the point of defending a bullet that will kill you? Are you crazy?
I am an average person, and my GPU is running a chatbot which currently gives me a course in Regular Expressions. My GPU also generates images for me from time to time when i need an image, because i am crappy at drawing. There are a lot of uses for the technology.
Okay so you could have just looked up one of dozens of resources on regex. The images you “need” are likely bad copies of images that already exist, or they’re weird collages of copied subject matter.
My point isn’t that there’s nothing they can do at all, it’s that nothing they can do is worth the energy cost. You’re spending tons of energy to effectively chew up information already on the web and have it vomited back to you in a slightly different form, when you could have just looked up the information directly. It doesn’t save time, because you have to double check everything. The images are also plagiarized, and you could be paying an artist if they’re something important, or improving your artistic abilities if they aren’t. I struggle to think of many cases where one of those options is unfeasible, it’s just the “easy” way out (because the energy costs are obfuscated) to have a machine crunch up some existing art to get a approximation of what you want.
Regarding energy use see my other reply. It’s like if you scold people for running their microwave 10s too long. Watching 2 hours of Netflix is a lot worse. go read up here
scraping the web to create a dataset isn’t plagiarism, same with training a model on said scraped data, and calculating which words should come in what order isn’t plagiarism too. I agree that datasets should be ethically sourced, but scraping the web is something that allowed such things as the search engine to be created, which made the web a lot more useful. Was creating google irresponsible?
This is a wild take. You can get chatbots to vomit out entire paragraphs of published works verbatim. There is functionally no mechanism to a chatbot other than looking at a bunch existing texts, picking one randomly, and copying the next word from it. There’s no internal processing or logic that you could call creative, it’s just sticking one Lego at a time onto a tower, and every Lego is someone’s unpaid intellectual property.
There is no definition of plagiarism or copyright that LLMs don’t bite extremely hard. They’re just getting away with it because of the billions of dollars of capital pushing the tech. I am hypothetically very much for the complete abolition of copyright and free usage of information, but a) that means everyone can copy stuff freely, instead of just AI companies, and b) it first requires an actually functional society that provides for the needs of its citizens so they can have the time to do stuff like create art without needing to make a livable profit at it. And even if that were the case, I would still think the current implementation of AI is pretty shitty if it’s burning the same ludicrous amounts of energy to do its parlor tricks.
The energy costs are overblown. An response costs about 3Wh, which is about 1 minute of runtime for a 200W Pc, or 10 Seconds of a 1000W microwave. See the calculations made here and below for the energy costs. if you want to save energy, go vegan and ditch your car; completely disbanding ChatGPT amounts for 0,0017% of the CO2 Reduction during Covid 2020 (this guy gave the numbers, but had an error in magnitude, which i fixed in my reply, calculator output is attached. It would help climate activists if they concentrated on something that is worthwhile to criticize.
If i read a book, and use phrases out of that book in my communication, it is covered under fair use - the same should be applicable for scraping the web, or else we can close the internet archive next. Since LLM output isn’t copyrightable, i see no issues with that - and copyright law in the US is an abomination which is only useful for big companies to use as a weapon, small artists don’t really profit from that.
The costs for responses are overblown, but the costs for training are not.
Adding the cost for training, which is a one time cost, to ChatGPT raises the power consumption from 3W to 4W. That’s the high-end calculation btw.
I can create undetectable deepfakes in gimp or Photoshop.
That is crazy, dude. You gotta teach me. There are soo many impoverished countries I wanna fuck over with this skill.
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There is something fundamentally fucked up in a country that arrests and puts in jail a 13 years old kid over a bad joke.
And strip-searched!
Without notifying parents
Oh I missed that bit. JFC she’s 13. How can police be so clueless about their own job… rhetorical question, I know the answer.
“clueless” thats pretty much what the leo jobs are.
You don’t understand, they are brown \s
But can’t put the pedo convicted felon grifter behind bars…
The result of “no tolerance policies”.
Are schools not government organisations (in most cases) and would they not be subject to the first amendment?
The first amendment is not absolute - things like threats are not protected speech. Although I agree that in this instance there might be a case that her constitutional rights were violated, I suspect it would be dismissed as having been a justifiable action from the administration/police who “couldn’t ignore a credible threat” or something equally bullshit…
Holy shit, the amount of surveillance the teens are under is ungodly and people blame the chatbot? And there wasn’t even a human kind enough to speak with the girl before calling the fucking cops? I see a lot of blame to place here, but it’s not the chatbot who is to blame.
- The kids for bullying her for her tan
- The school boards implementing the surveillance
- The parents who allowed such surveillance in the first place
- The person screening what was flagged for not sending the school counselor to talk with the kid
- The person calling the cops
- The cops for arresting an 8th-grader and DOING A STRIP SEARCH AND KEEPING HER OVERNIGHT WTF instead of handing her over to her parents
Everyone of them failed a 13 year old girl. All of them should be ashamed.
The cops for arresting an 8th-grader
This is America, that’s what they do. They love overreacting to small problems.
I was arrested for self-defence in a highschool fight, the actual bully who attack me did not get in any sort of trouble. If I didn’t have citizenship, there was a chance that incident could’ve led to my deportation, even tho I was a minor. (USCIS can see all your arrests, including those that did not led to a conviction, or even expunged or pardoned offences, and they could retroactively revoke your legal status if they find out you lied.) But luckily charges were dropped because of couse they don’t have the evidence to prove it and I have a clean record so they didn’t bother prosecuting.
There is probably an alternate timeline somewhere out there in the multiverse where I got deported and had to learn another language that I haven’t spoken for over a decade. Depressing to think about.
(Well that is still technically a possibility, all they have to do is make up some bullshit about “being a spy” and put me in gitmo)
I’m in Canada and it’s only marginally better with respect to police under/overreaction. A friend and I once got the “don’t go to school on X day” message and we went immediately to local, provincial, and federal police. No one took us seriously. We had a friend working at CSIS (American analogue would be CIA) look into it and later that week we saw the article in a local paper.
Police investigated the home and found:
- 5000 rounds of ammunition
- body armor
- explosives
- only thing he couldn’t get was legal firearms because of his history of mental illness, but he had been working on connections to acquire illegal ones
Point being we couldn’t get the police to lift a finger to check out what we believed to be a credible threat (this guy never even joked about that stuff), but boy were they willing to burn rubber racing to my school when I committed the crime of defending myself in a “normal” school fight and one of my bullies claimed they felt threatened by me. This event set off a whole series of events, like requiring me to get a full evaluation at a psychiatric facility, before being allowed back in school. Our system is broken.
They love overreacting to small problems.
It’s what they do instead of reacting to major problems in any way.
One of my possible theories is that the alternate timelines diverge for each of us at moments we could have died. The timeline diverges and one continues on with us and one without us; sometimes while “dying” timelines merge back together resulting in stories like reddit’s r/glitchinthematrix
So if it’s any consolation, your bully probably died in your deportation timeline.
At any moment a tiny bit of clotted blood cells could suddenly lodge somewhere inconvenient and kill you so this timeline shit would be happening every second 24/7. Kind of renders these timeline thought experiments pointless.
That would just be a possibility until it actually happens, until the actual crisis point.
For example, we’re not diverging with every step on a flight of stairs. However, have you ever experienced that moment of vertigo where you thought you missed a step and then felt your foot land solid on the next? That would be the moment.
I don’t think that’s how quantum immortality works.
I don’t think I called my theory ‘quantum immortality’ 🤔😉
Ya, AI is not the story here.
The kids for bullying her for her tan
To me it didn’t sound like she was being bullied, it seemed like her friends made a stupid joke and then she responded with another stupid joke. Which makes it even stupider that she got arrested. Literally just kids being kids.
The US will do anything and everything except try proper gun control
Proper gun control? Nah let’s spy on kids
It’s for the children!!
/s
For them they are not children but rather wolves that can snap, so they try to make them obedient dogs.
No, rather, to monitor future slaves so that they are obedient.
This is exactly what is going to happen with the fucking chat control of the EU actually enforces it, but for an entire continent. Fuck this shit. Privacy is a human right.
I am Canadian, how can I help? Because this shit is coming to Canada, too.
The only hope is to immigrate to a place without this shit.
Go fuck yourself (As in the school)
Why are you being so aggressive?
Why are you being so passive?
There’s not much else the little guy can do. 😔
When the rain starts coming through this tree, we’ll just move to another one.
Ez bro just get on a plane
that defeatist attitude is helping no one and is not how a resilient democracy survives
We’re way past a resilient democracy buddy.
with this attitude certainly, buddy
but seriously, yes it’s scary what is happening around the world right now but that means we as citizens need to organize and resist. This is how every social and moral good that we enjoy today was won. Freedom from oppression is a constant fight and always has been
It’s your choice, but I’m leaving.
Immigrating costs billions of dollars
The countries where this is not happening is narrowing so seriously that there is no where left to run.
The few ones are already good enough.
Arrested and strip-searched for a first offense? That’s fucking ridiculous. I hope the lawsuit succeeds. It’s the only peaceful tool we have to curb over-zealous law enforcement.
Before the morning was even over, the Tennessee eighth grader was under arrest. She was interrogated, strip-searched and spent the night in a jail cell, her mother says.
Earlier in the day, her friends had teased the teen about her tanned complexion and called her “Mexican,” even though she’s not. When a friend asked what she was planning for Thursday, she wrote: “on Thursday we kill all the Mexico’s.”
This is an ass-covering response to school shootings, because some of the shooters have expressed their intent before.
A strip search obviously isn’t necessary even if it’s a credible threat; a metal detector wand and basic pat down is more than enough to ensure someone doesn’t have a gun. This wasn’t a credible threat though, and a chat with the school counselor would have been the right way to handle this.
Yeah, that was my first thought too. I can see the need to take anything that resembles an actionable threat seriously, but that poor kid did not deserve to be abused by law enforcement like that.
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Students who think they are chatting privately among friends often do not realize they are under constant surveillance
This is the problem
Yea, if nothing else hopefully this will make at least a few kids think about online privacy.
My sense of humor is dry, dark, and absurdist. I’d go to jail every week for the sorts of things I joke about if I was a kid today. This is complete lunacy.
Example of an average joke on my part: speed up and run over that old lady crossing the street!
It makes my partner laugh. I laugh. We both know I don’t mean it. But a crappy AI tool wouldn’t understand that.
Something tells me that our type of jokes are on the way out bro. As you said, there’s no room for nuance in this story, so I’m afraid we’ll eventually all be listened in on 100% of the time until someone says something ‘actionable’. If you’re not already on a multitude of lists by now, you’re doing something wrong.
Nah, dark humor is like a child with cancer, it never gets old.
My understanding is those types of jokes are now en vogue, at least with Republicans. Wait, maybe it’s only wrong when they’re jokes, but it’s OK when the Republicans are serious about these things.
Depends on the complexion of the old lady crossing the street.
Yeah especially around middle school, the “darker” the “joke” the more funny it was
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Just don’t allow an ai on the jury. If you are on a jury tell tpe judge you want the prosecuting lawyers disbarred for wasting your time.
You know what really grinds my gears? This shitty dystopia completely eschews any potentially cool aspect of invasive exploitative authoritarianism. The (not so) secret police is patching together their own “uniforms” by browsing the bargain bins at the local tacti-cool mall-ninja outfitters. Where’s the black leather trench coats, stylish sunglasses worn after dark and slicked back hair? If they’re going to ask me for ‘ze papers’ all the time, the least they can do is look cool doing it, godamnit. At least get Hugo Boss to design your attire; that’s just about the only thing that worked out well for the last bunch of pricks.
I mean, where’s the towering brutalist architecture? Where’s my mandatory daily dose of SOMA? Or my idiotically wirelessly hackable cyberware? Hell, they can’t even do bread and circuses right anymore. The bread is CO2-pumped flour glue and the circuses is an endless stream of more Marvel projects and Disney violations of Star Wars.
And don’t get me started on the quality of our dictators these days. They sure don’t make them like they used to.
Can’t they at least smoke cigarettes in a cool and threatening manner?!
I think that’s illegal now too. Can’t have anything interfering with the glorious vision of a relentlessly productive citizenry that ideally slave away for the benefits of their owners until they die in the office chair at age 74 - right before qualifying for pension.
Well, except for the health “care” system. That’s an exception, but only because the only thing better than ruthless exploitation is diversified ruthless exploitation. Gotta keep the peons on their toes, lest they get uppity.
I think one rich man in the past said - I don’t need a nation of thinkers, I need a nation of slaves. Unless I’m mistaken of course. It’s like saying predators have learned not to chase their prey but to raise it, giving it the illusion of freedom, although in fact they are leading it to slaughter like cattle. I like this idea with cattle I couldn’t resist lol. :3
Hey, some of the newer Star Wars stuff is alright! Sometimes!
Mom, can we have Equilibrium at home?
“ICE reached out to both Mr. Bale and Mr. Bean in an attempt to address the current gun-fu deficit of the agency, but regrettably neither had any interest in the job.”
I mean, where’s the towering brutalist architecture?
I think China is doing a good job at that.
The whole trend of teens rejecting phones for dumbphones is making sense now. If you can’t fight big mainstream technology, then fuck big mainstream technology!
As soon as my pixel 8 shits the bed I’m going back to a dumbphone
I’m gonna snag another used Oneplus phone that has decent community love and keep rolling custom roms until Google stops me.
…and once they stop me(in ten years or so), a dumphone with tethering and a secondary device. And if they implant a chip into my brain, I’ll go luddite, live in the woods, read poetry and eat mushrooms.
Hey, this is me! Currently using a OnePlus 5 with LineageOS and a Sunbeam phone. If I need to connect to the Internet or use any phone app, I just use my hotspot.
and then it’s even worse, you go through sms which is even less confidential
…In a way yes, in a way no. A phone that’s SMS and Calls only has a few advantages. One is that other apps can’t spy on SMS because there aren’t other apps to spy on the SMS. The SMS vulnerabilities en-route still exist, sure, but you’re no longer being monitored by Apple, Google or anyone else by default.
Sure, the ideal situation is for all of them to get on Signal, XMPP, Briar, SimpleX… fucking roll a D20. They’re also more about it due to screen-on time than privacy. I don’t think they’re of any belief that privacy is even attainable.
Encrypted messengers for the win
I hope a future where Google is kicked out of Android but that won’t happen
